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Tony Grist

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The Right Thing [Mar. 19th, 2011|10:56 am]
Tony Grist
I believe it was the right thing to do to challenge Gaddafi.

When a murderous bully is gaining the upper hand- and you're bigger than he is and have a fair chance of stopping him, it's wrong to sit on your hands.

This intervention was possible. And the calculations suggest a fair outcome is likelier than a miserable one. 

I have, in the past, called myself a pacifist. Obviously this was a lie.

[User Picture]From: endlessrarities
2011-03-19 02:04 pm (UTC)
I just wish I wasn't going on holiday to the Mediterranean next month. The timing ain't good:-0
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-19 02:13 pm (UTC)
Oh dear, no, it ain't.
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[User Picture]From: arielstarshadow
2011-03-19 02:19 pm (UTC)
Realizing that it's time someone needs to step up and stop the violence and atrocity doesn't make you a liar. There are all sorts of "flavors" of pacifism, and not all of them mean no violence, ever, under any circumstances. I'd say that it's more that you've realized that your desire for a lack of violence has a limit, and that limit has been reached:

...the obliteration of force except in cases where it is absolutely necessary to advance the cause of peace
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-19 02:27 pm (UTC)
Thank you.

I guess I'm one of the more nuanced kinds of pacifist.
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[User Picture]From: pondhopper
2011-03-19 02:42 pm (UTC)
I still think you're very much a pacifist but pacifism isn't always about sitting still and protesting. You're a pacifist who also believes in justice and fairness.
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-19 03:34 pm (UTC)
Sometimes war is the lesser evil...
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[User Picture]From: ron_broxted
2011-03-19 03:51 pm (UTC)
Challenge the bastards in Burma, in Peking, in Uzbekistan, in North Korea, in Djakarta, oh wait, that does not suit US policy!
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-19 04:30 pm (UTC)
Sadly not. There are several other Middle Eastern countries one could add to that list.
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From: algabal
2011-03-19 04:26 pm (UTC)
Will you fight, then? What if you were a young man? Will you encourage your children to join and fight? Whose children do you desire to be sent to Libya?
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-19 04:42 pm (UTC)
Our current wars are being fought by professional armies, so the question doesn't arise.

Had I been around in 1914 or 1939 I would almost certainly have volunteered and wound up in uniform. I can also imagine myself as a young man joining the International Brigade in Spain.

I had a son in the army. He served in Iraq. It was his choice to be in uniform- and I respected that- even though I disapproved of that particular war. If he were still a soldier- and deployed to Libya- he would go with my blessing.
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[User Picture]From: airstrip
2011-03-20 02:31 am (UTC)
First, I'm so glad France and Britain took the lead here, not us.

Second, I think the major differences are diplomatic and strategic. Everyone but Gaddafi himself is against him. Even his ambassadors and UN representative defected. From a strategic perspective, Libya is literally right over there. There's no need to occupy the country or rely heavily on permanent infrastructure of any kind. No "ongoing commitment" needs to be made through encampments.
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[User Picture]From: poliphilo
2011-03-20 09:19 am (UTC)
I hope you're right about the "ongoing commitment", but I don't suppose anyone has much idea what will happen once Gaddafi is overthrown. Is there a government in waiting? Probably not.
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[User Picture]From: calizen
2011-03-20 03:48 pm (UTC)
Fascinating opinions on all shades of pacifistic thoughts here. You can see that Monsieur Bush has really made an impact on lots and lots of people, but obviously not in the way he intended.
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[User Picture]From: chochiyo_sama
2011-03-21 03:53 am (UTC)
Even a pacifist will put down a rabid animal.

The guy is a mad dog, a danger to every living creature in his country. It's time to put him down.
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[User Picture]From: steepholm
2011-03-21 10:50 am (UTC)
Arguments that someone should be killed because they're less than human always make me uneasy.
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